Taking your toys to rallies

Just a day or so before Christmas I got a phone call about it being illegal to put anything on the back of our trucks to take them to rallies. As an example and as I have been told if I put say the David Brown tractor on the back of Lorry and travel to a Rally I can now be fined $2k.
Now I questioned the info because Lorry hs full NSW rego and full insurance, David is covered by the Clubs insurance providing it is going to a Club event so it must be legal to do so. Then he told me that another problem is that Lorry has a winch. I know, I put it there in case David or any other toy to be loaded broke down and I could recover it myself. I sent an email to our locaal Member and I dont expect a reply any time soon being the festive season the email will be acknowledge and passed onto the relevant Minister for a reply.
Oddly enough I did hear something along these lines on talk back radio a few months ago and I think it was from interstate ut not sure. The thinkin g is so I have been told is that the towing industry are complaining that they have to pay big money for a towing license and so should we. I said that we do not make a living nor money out of attending Rallies rather it costs us money. he then said that Clubs make the money so we ar in an indirect way making money from it. I would like to see all the deposits into my bank account for this service that doesn't hapen.
It will be interstng to hear other thoughts on this or if it is B/S or fact.

Been NSW I couldnt and shouldnt even try to pretend I know

But my 2 bobs worth anyway

On faceless book there has been talk of this and from what I have understood is that if you own the load and the truck you cant possibly be making money out of carting your own gear around
However I doubt if anything on faceless book is based on fact

I wonder if it would be easier to have the winch eother mou ted bellow the floor under a trap door or on a reciever like a hayman reece tow bar

I guess the tow truck companies have a point because like all things people like to push the boundries (my self included) and the line must be drawn somewhere

Paul

Have a read of this Cobba .
www.cosboa.org.au/tow-truck-laws

If the blurb is correct Ian that would mean as long as the winch isnt on a tilt tray it is good to go, or did I miss read that
A trailer is fine with a winch as long as its not a tilting trailer ?

Paul

From what I've read, you have to be carrying on a business to be penalised. A recent example I saw was a guy towing a car body on a car trailer behind his ute, to make money selling the car body for scrap. Because he was carrying on a business (selling scrap) he was fine $8,000 for operating a tow truck without a tow truck license, and being an unlicensed tow truck operator. As I understand it, he wouldn't be fined if he was just someone taking his old car to the wreckers to get rid of it.

Yes that is my understanding as well, how ever I dunno if my word would do anyone much good when getting booked lol

Paul

Being involved in the tow truck industry as a licenced driver for many years, I feel I know a little about the way things operate in NSW. Even to hold a Tow Truck Drivers Certificate, you have to apply each year, not just renew the old one, along with the appropriate fees and a fresh Pass Port photo.. In addition I have supply a medical certificate to the insurance company before the license is issued.

Yes the regulations as written are ridiculous. The bit about carrying stuff over the border is as stated in the attachment.
Cobba, you can carry anything on your truck, provided it is not a motor vehicle which has been involved in an accident. You can carry anything to and from a Rally or show, be it your property or that of someone else. This holds true even on Historic Vehicle Permit, PROVIDED THAT YOU ARE NOT RECEIVING PAYMENT OF ANY KIND FOR DOING SO. The fitment of your winch is subject to interpretation.

Now to winches. There has been quite a lot of talk recently of a blanket banning winches on all trailers. A bit hard when ALL includes boat trailers. Car carriers in NSW are not permitted to have loading winches fitted, otherwise they are classed as Tow Trucks. When it comes to load restraints, car carrier have to have at least 2 diagonally opposite wheels restrained, whereas tow trucks must have at lest 4 restraints per vehicle, with the winch not allowed to have any tension on the vehicle. This I find is absolutely ridiculous. They have more faith in 4 ratchet straps than they do in a 10 ton, wire cable winch.

The problem stems from the ambiguity of the regulations which leave so much to the interpretation by the enforcement officer, be they RMS or the Police. I once went to get Historic rego on a caravan. The local Office would not allow it as vans were not covered under the appropriate Regs. They referred me to Head Office in Botany who backed up their claim. When I explained to them that a box trailer (BXT in their terms) was ok and a boat trailer (BTT) was also included, I asked why a caravan (CVT) was exempt, it only took a minute for the penny to drop. Van passed.
Steve.

What a bloody mess it appears to be in. Thenks to all the rplies and interests on this topic and I am still not convinced that someone with the ability to write out a fi ne either police or rms could be trusted enough to give the right answers or not fine you. I see them both a lot near home so I will play the devils advocate again with them and see what comes of it. Last time I spoke to 2 rms guys on the side of the3 road about fitting a white flood light for loading in the dark facing rearwards gave me 2 opposite replies and started a debate between them both so I never bothered. If 2 inspectors standing side by side can't agree if it would be legal what hope has anyone got. Not even the heavy haulage mob could give a direct answer. Drive up and down the highway and almost all prime movers have a spot light facing rearwards near the rear view mirrior or hanging off the roof line and don't get fined. It s amystery to me at times.

Cobba, with regard to fitting a Loading Light to your truck, if it is fitted with the operating switch external to the cab, so it cannot be operated while the vehicle is moving it would be classed as "legal".

Tow trucks in NSW are required to have them fitted to the tray and the cradle lift if fitted.

There is often quite a lot of crap out there regarding additional lights on trucks, LEDS etc. with defects being issued if they are not working. Provided that all the lights required under the ADR's are fitted and working, any additional lights do not have to be operating, PROVIDED THEY DISPLAY THE CORRECT COLOUR FOR THEIR POSITION ON THE VEHICLE. The blue or green lights in the air intakes of LOUIS come to mind.

If you have nothing to do for a few hours, Google ADR Lighting Regulations and sit back.

The NSW tow truck regs were supposed to address organised crime among the competing city towies. Trouble is the Tow truck Industry Council uses organised crime as it's business model and takes a cut on every movement in order to perpetuate itself. Interestingly they say they have a "community member" on the Council but when you look that rep comes from the far west of NSW - nicely sidelined!. The RMS inspectors are in on it because it's another free kick ($300 fine if your broom stick has been cut to fit in the tool box). What I can't work out is what's in it for Highway Patrol - some HP commands are pulling car trailers all the time while other commands are not interested at all. The winch story is about defining what is a rescue job (your own vehicle or not, crash or break down). If you drive on you can claim to be a car carrier. So keep your winch in the boot while travelling and keep winging to your MP.