LPG boost for diesels

Going back a few years, were a few blokes tinkering with LPG boosting for diesel engines. Bloke somewhere in Melbourne had an ACCO with a 903 (I think) he did a bit of testing on and either wrote it up for a supplement to a weekend metro newspaper or may have been one of the defunct trucking mag's.
Don't know if anyone ever persevered with them as such, wouldn't have thought that the extra expense would have been too much of an impost if you saved a bit of fuel.
I can't remember the exact gist of it, think this bloke was thinking it more of an aid for giving a few more horses when working in heavy going.
Maybe didn't feel any great use for the system now that full electronic injection controlled by computers and sensors is pretty much the order of todays modern engines. Or it may have been simply that the costs outweighed the investment?
Hardly think it would be worthwhile just to extend the fuel range, as most trucks seemed to have reasonably adequate sized tanks.
May also be like a lot of improvements which had run their course and since been replaced by better variable turbo, timing and generally engines running much cooler as well as cleaner??

There was also a bloke playing around quite a few years ago as well, with a water injection system which I think may have been based on the old Willy's design of squirting a bit of vapour into the cylinder. I always thought that was more to improve combustion on poor quality petrol and achieve better fuel burn.
At the time, wondered how a diesel combustion system would handle that (water injection, whatever the delivery method), with a lot higher pressures and temperatures, probably have to modify pistons and combustion chamber design??
Anyone still having a tinker with either of these ideas?
Dave

Cogz
m80
Have U bin here
www.hcvc.com.au/forum/truck_Chat/4462-ga...ersions?limitstart=0
cya
§

Dave

I currently run 13 Prime Movers on LPG / Diesel

The blend is 23% LPG which is equal to 18% diesel.

First 2 we done a Cummins and a Volvo havnt missed a beat in 2 years, the others are all FH and FM Volvos.

Cost is around $14,000 per drive in drive out with payback on triaxle work at 220,000 klm with LPG at 74 - 76 cents per litre

The system is a sandwich plate which sits between the head and the intake manifold with unit LPG injectors at the entrance of each intake port. ECM is mapped to ensure no pre detonation ect like what used to happen.

We used the same company to do the emission testing that found the issues with VW as such regulators are on board.

67

Thanks for both the replies and the links. Probably a well balanced discussion from both sides of the fence. Not even sure of why it came up other than someone or other must have asked me if I ever had anything to do with it, ( I hadn't, other than what I had read yonks ago), bottom line seems to be that if it was so successful, maybe the manufacturers or even the engine makers could have jumped on the bandwagon?? 67mustang may have revealed initial reluctance to some with the average investment of 14 odd grand per unit, a lot of others may be thinking that short term that would buy a reasonable amount of fuel, but not if your running fleet numbers. Be interesting to see or hear what some of the really large owners think. Thanks again, Dave.

.
Dave.....
many moons ago in Burwood , west Sydney....An old race car driver by the name of Frank Klienig
used to sell a water injection thingo , but I think it was only for petrol donks...……
Trying to recall the name of the set up...….... some thing like Mist Master comes to mind...………..
……………………...Billy...…………………….

Billy P you're correct again."MistMaster" it was.

Ran a Cooling Mist water/methanol kit on an Rb25 Skyline. Hard getting anyone to tune it, made 260rwwk on PULP and pushed 300 when the brew was added. Of course everyone is making 300 these days with E85 but back then they were big numbers. Stopped detonation in its tracks so we could add IGN. Finding the limit is difficult.
Needs to be injected in the plenum where you'll get the most inlet temp reduction.
If you're bored Google up Frank Walker and check out W/M injection on WW2 aircraft engines. I believe it's also used in turbine aircraft engines.
Can be used on a diesel with quite astounding results. Again Google will give a few hits.
Have been thinking of giving it a whirl on my gutless KZ diesel Prado, but finding a spot for the tank is always a drama.

67Mustang, What system are you using???

Dave

Am running 8O plus prime movers in fleet, tris, B/D and R/TS, max weights loaded and 23 tonne empty.

The last 10 new prime movers have all been ordered with room for LPG tank on chassis.

Last one we fitted done 5 back to back trips from Pt Botany to Darwin, running home empty with exceptional klm to the lt.

Heyseed

System is a PRINS LPG UNIT

67mustang

G,day all,
Thought I'd add my two cents worth if it helps.
I'm a certified gas fitter and also got my endorsement at diesel gas Australia with the levato system about ten years back.
The first thing I did was fit it to my wife's vehicle ( 2.8 factory turbo Pajero), set it up on a dyno with gas anyliser , I noticed that precombustionstyle engines have their limitations and a limited amount can be added before you get detonation and black smoke, so I detuned the diesel side on the injectorpump (less diesel) and then could add more gas with cooler cleaner results with less nox emissions and cleaner burn and more horsepower, fitted a mandrel bent 2 1/2 exhaust system and safari snorkel to help it breath better as the factory exhaust was very restrictive ( gained two psi boost without touching the waste gate) , point in fact your engine must be in good codotion and breath well to make the most of the available benifets if the lp gas injection.
The levato is an electronic system programmed by laptop on the vehicle by the installer.
The results were great, fuel economy went from 8.0 kpl up to 9.8 kpl , don't ask for gas vs diesel cost % as I can't remember that now , heaps more torque ( was like driving a Mack engine torque from 900 rpm), due to the ability to dial it in wherever you like on the lap top during setup. had to be careful of the amount of gas injection at full power as egt's would climb quickly, found that adding more gas at cruise was where the economy was gained and the safest temps. direct injection diesels give you a bit more scope with the gas injection, cruisers, series 60 detroits etc.
had the gas on the Pajero for 4 years without any issues the kept the kit when I sold the vehicle.
Would I fit it again ? Maybe to trucks, but my current argosys with detroits I'm thinking of hydrogen injection( water is free ).
Hope this may help.
Trav.